US embassy cable - 05HOCHIMINHCITY1182

UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 03 HO CHI MINH CITY 001182 
 
SIPDIS 
 
SENSITIVE 
 
E.O. 12958:  N/A 
TAGS: PHUM, SOCI, PREL, PGOV, KIRF, VM, HUMANR, RELFREE 
SUBJECT:  THREE HCMC HOUSE CHURCHES SEEK LEGALIZATION, BUT 
IT'S SLOW GOING 
 
REF: A) HCMC 1082; B) HCMC 847 and previous; C) Hanoi 2763 
 
1. (SBU) Summary:  Leaders of three house church 
organizations headquartered in HCMC -- Baptist, Mennonite 
and Seventh Day Adventist -- have applied to legalize their 
operations in HCMC, the first such applications under 
Vietnam's legal framework on religion.  Although they have 
the legal right to register their entire national 
organizations with the central-level Committee for Religious 
Affairs (CRA), they have been "guided" to apply first for 
their HCMC operations only.  These house church leaders have 
decided not to challenge the CRA on this point of law; they 
do not want to rock the boat when conditions for their 
churches are improving throughout southern Vietnam.  In our 
discussions with the HCMC CRA, we pressed for clear and 
faithful implementation of the legal framework writ large 
and for a proactive and constructive approach in these three 
groundbreaking cases.  (Ref A discusses the status of the 
Danang-based United World Mission Church, which also is 
seeking to legalize its status under Vietnam's new legal 
framework on religion.)  End Summary. 
 
Vietnam Southern Baptist Convention 
----------------------------------- 
 
2. (SBU) In mid-October, PolOff met with Pastor Le Quoc 
Chanh, the President of the Vietnam Southern Baptist 
Convention (VSBC), one of at least seven Baptist 
organizations operating in southern and central Vietnam. 
According to Chanh, the church has approximately 2,200 
adherents, including 500 in HCMC.  Active in Vietnam for 
over thirty years, the church has two ordained pastors and 
60 lay preachers.  He stressed that "this is a real [head] 
count and not an inflated number like those given by other 
organizations."   HCMC congregations gather daily.  In other 
provinces, worshippers meet at least once a week. 
Currently, the VSBC operates one church building in HCMC, 
with capacity for over 200.  However, this church will be 
demolished in 2006 as the city widens the road to the 
airport.  The VSBC plans to build a new church in 
partnership with a Korean Protestant church, and hopes that 
government compensation, along with fundraising, will cover 
the building costs of the new structure.  The VSBC also has 
an additional 60 gathering points throughout the country. 
 
3. (SBU) The VSBC appears to have good lines of 
communication with Government and Party.  Chanh told us 
that, even before the Ordinance on Religion and Faith came 
into effect in November 2004, officials of the Central-level 
Committee for Religious Affairs (CRA) approached officials 
of the VSBC and suggested that they submit a history of 
their organization and activities prior to 1975 in 
preparation for the group's eventual recognition.  Chanh 
noted that, after he submitted the requested paperwork, it 
became easier for VSBC to meet and organize and police 
harassment stopped almost completely.  Following the 
promulgation of the Implementing Guidelines to the Ordinance 
in March 2005, the HCMC CRA encouraged the VSBC and two 
other HCMC-based groups (Mennonites and Seventh Day 
Adventists) to register according to the new legal framework 
on religion.  The VSBC submitted its application along with 
supplemental documents in August 2005.  (The Implementing 
Guidelines mandate a 45-day time frame for consideration of 
a registration application, 60 days if the church has a 
presence in more than one province.  There is a 60-day 
window for applications for recognition for single-province 
churches, 90 days for multi-province operations.  Recognized 
churches are given additional rights under the GVN's two- 
tier system.  Please see HCMC 288 and HCMC 238 for 
additional details on Vietnam's legal framework on 
religion.) 
 
4. (SBU) In a November 2 phone conversation with us, Chanh 
said that he had just confirmed with the CRA that the VSBC's 
application was complete.  The CRA gave no indication when a 
decision would be forthcoming.  Chanh has no intention of 
pressing the matter, as the process is not a top priority 
for the church.  He fretted that bureaucratic sluggishness 
and obstruction could pose a problem for the VSBC once it 
was legalized.  He cited the example of two unrecognized 
Baptist denominations that were seeking to establish a 
children's program.  One did not seek official permission 
and was able to complete their project.  The other group 
"went through the proper channels and had a lot of problems 
with paperwork."  On the other hand, Chang said that, upon 
recognition, the VSBC will petition to regain church 
property in HCMC, Nha Trang, Dalat, Cam Ranh, Quy Nhon and 
Danang that GVN had confiscated in 1975. 
 
Mennonite Church 
---------------- 
 
5. (SBU) Also in mid-October, we met with Pastor Nguyen 
Quang Trung, President of the Mennonite Church in Vietnam, 
to review progress in legalizing his church's operations. 
(Ref B reports on prior meetings with Pastor Trung.)   Trung 
said that his house church organization, which has over 
8,000 worshippers and 120 pastors and preachers, "does not 
have problems, as the CRA knows everything that we do." 
Although the church is not yet registered, it is able to 
conduct "normal activities," such as holding organizational 
meetings of pastors from different provinces on a quarterly 
basis.  Parishioners are able to gather for Sunday worship, 
even in the Central Highlands provinces of Kontum, Gia Lai 
and Dak Lak.  Local governments also allow the church to 
gather to celebrate other holidays with advance 
notification.  Since 1979, the Mennonite church has sent 
letters to the GVN asking for return of four confiscated 
properties; Trung is hopeful that he may gain some traction 
on the issue once his church is legalized. 
 
6. (SBU) Trung's Mennonite church has been working with the 
HCMC CRA since April on legal registration for its HCMC 
operations.   Most of the paperwork is complete -- there are 
at least nine extensive forms that the applying church had 
to submit -- but the HCMC CRA was seeking clarification of 
the status of Pastor Trung's house as a place of worship for 
the Church.  In early November, Trung answered this final 
CRA query, technically starting the 45-day clock within 
which HCMC authorities must rule on his application. 
 
7.  (SBU) Like the VSBC, Truong was in no rush to legalize 
his church's status.  Even though it has no official status 
yet, Trung stressed that many local authorities have been 
willing to help facilitate land purchase and church 
construction as long as the church could afford to buy land 
on its own.  That said, registration appeared to be 
important to the GVN, which was why he was pursuing 
registration. 
 
8. (SBU) Pastor Trung also spoke to the ongoing split within 
the Mennonite Church in Vietnam.  The other faction, led by 
Pastor Nguyen Hong Quang, former General Secretary of 
Trung's church, held an organizational meeting earlier this 
year while Quang still was in prison.  That meeting declared 
Quang's wife Acting President of the Church until Quang was 
released and could assume the Presidency.  According to 
Trung, that meeting violated the Mennonite Church's internal 
charter.  Trung also alleged that other Mennonite pastors 
had been tricked into attending, having been invited to a 
Bible study.  Trung noted that his church enjoyed the 
support of the Eastern Mennonite Mission Asia, while the 
North America Mennonite Church apparently supported Quang. 
 
Seventh Day Adventists 
---------------------- 
 
9. (SBU) In mid-October, PolOff met with Pastor Tran Cong 
Tan and other members of the Seventh Day Adventist Church at 
their headquarters in HCMC.  The Seventh Day Adventist 
church was established in Vietnam in 1914.  In 1974, the 
Vietnam branch had 42 churches and approximately 15,000 
followers, the majority of whom are from the ethnic minority 
community.  The Seventh Day Adventists owned and operated 
two hospitals in HCMC.   Post-1975, all its property, with 
the exception of seven churches, had been expropriated. 
 
10. (SBU) According to Tan, as GVN repression of the church 
has eased in recent years, the number of worshippers has 
returned to pre-1975 levels.  There are three Seventh Day 
Adventist churches in HCMC with between 600 and 2,000 
members (the members of the board could not agree on the 
exact number of worshippers).  There are another four 
churches and 35 other house church congregations operating 
across Vietnam, including the Central Highlands.  Overall, 
conditions for religious freedom have improved significantly 
since the new legal framework on religion was promulgated, 
although there are episodic difficulties at the local level, 
particularly in the Central Highlands province of Dak Lak. 
Tan explained that ethnic minority members of the church 
were suspected of supporting ethnic minority separatism and 
of participating in the "Dega Protestant Church." 
 
11. (SBU) Every year since 1975, the Seventh Day Adventists 
had sent a request to Hanoi for recognition, which had gone 
unanswered.  The situation began to change in mid-2004, when 
church leaders first met with HCMC CRA.  The church began 
its formal registration process in June 2005. According to 
Cong, the church completed the application process in 
August.  Church leaders remained in constant contact with 
HCMC CRA.  "If all goes well, the church will gain formal 
GVN recognition by the end of this year," commented Tan. 
 
HCMC CRA 
-------- 
 
12. (SBU) On November 2 we met with Tran Ngoc Bao, HCMC CRA 
Vice Chairman in charge of Protestant and Catholic issues to 
review progress in registering churches and overall 
implementation of the legal framework on religion in HCMC. 
Bao emphasized his commitment to work with HCMC's house 
church organizations to regularize their status, and pointed 
to the significant improvement in religious freedom 
conditions for these groups in the city.  (Our discussion on 
the status of the expatriate New Life Fellowship church will 
be reported by septel.) 
 
13.  (SBU) According to Bao, of the three house church 
organizations applying for legalization of status, only the 
Seventh Day Adventists had completed the needed paperwork. 
He expressed frustration that despite his urging, the other 
two groups were not responding promptly to CRA calls for 
additional information, slowing down the process.  Bao said 
that house churches do not feel any urgency to register now 
that their day-to-day activities have been "normalized," 
albeit not fully legalized.  Bao complained that other 
prominent Protestant house church organizations have thus 
far refused to begin the registration process, although 
overall dialogue with them has improved. 
 
14. (SBU) Although Bao acknowledged that, under the law 
these groups had a right to apply immediately for nationwide 
registration, he "requested" that they start the process at 
the local level, in the jurisdiction where their 
headquarters is located.    Nationwide registration would 
take place "later," at the discretion of the central-level 
CRA, which might also solicit additional information from 
the religious organizations. 
 
15. (SBU) A leader from a second, larger Baptist house 
church group has told us that its efforts to register 
nationally were explicitly rejected by the central-level 
CRA.  The group was told that each house church would have 
to register at the local level.  Only when this process was 
completed would the central-level CRA consider their 
nationwide registration application.  The central-level CRA 
official also complained to him that the Baptists had "too 
many different groups" and needed to merge into one, perhaps 
two organizations, before they could be considered for 
national recognition.  As a result, the organization has 
decided not to pursue the process further at this time and 
is watching carefully the outcome of the three HCMC groups 
that have moved forward. 
 
Comment 
------- 
 
16. (SBU) The CRA's "encouragement" of the VSBC, Mennonites 
and Seventh Day Adventists to register locally may reflect 
uncertainty within the GVN and the Party over the 
implications of a sudden increase of newly legalized 
Protestant organizations throughout Vietnam.  At the very 
least, the risk-averse Vietnamese bureaucracy is trying to 
feel its way through a brand new process.  But if the CRA is 
playing it safe, so too are the three house church 
organizations.  They have decided not to challenge the 
"guidance" of the CRA to apply locally even though under the 
law they had the clear right to apply for registration for 
their entire church organization with the central-level CRA. 
Their operating environment has improved significantly over 
the past year and they will not do anything to jeopardize 
progress at this juncture. 
 
WINNICK